Off lead n recall

General discussion on all labradoodle-related matters - anything not otherwise covered by specific forums on the site.
janettehamman
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Location: Cheshire

Off lead n recall

Post by janettehamman » 31 Mar 2009, 13:28

Hi

More advice needed please. You can tell I'm a first time dog owner by all these questions :lol:

Holly is such a bouncy happy doodle that I haven't really let her off lead yet. I am terrified she will run off, i'm sure she has no sense of danger near cars and water and also jumping at people and kids. I know people have said take her where it's quiet to practice recall but that's not the same as when you let her off where there are distractions.

Any advice on how other doddles have got on with this.

Thanks
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tashanlouie
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Re: Off lead n recall

Post by tashanlouie » 31 Mar 2009, 13:36

I let both of mine off on their 1st walks as its easier to teach them as they want to be by your side.

However my eldest who is 18 months old now has no recall whats so ever so I have been taking him out on a longline so hes still got freedom and ive still got control. I take out really tasty treats such as liver that he doesn't get at home and I cotinually call him back to me, gently pulling at the longline so he knows to come.

My youngest pup is 14 weeks and I have been using a whistle with her and its excellent, really would suggest you give it a try :D

Good luck :mrgreen:
Tasha

mistydog
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Re: Off lead n recall

Post by mistydog » 31 Mar 2009, 14:56

Recall doesn't seem to be the Doodles best command! Freddie was great until he was about 7 months old and turned into Kevin. He now, at 11 months he doesn't have any recall at all and I use a long line. I am hoping he will get better as it is a pain, by old dog didn't need a lead unless we saw game, Freddie only has to see a sparrow. We went to puppy classes and now go to further classes and that would be the best way to go. Good luck.
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Pauline
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Re: Off lead n recall

Post by Pauline » 31 Mar 2009, 17:54

I let Dexter off the lead when he was very little and encouraged him to come back - as someone else has said it is a doodle trait that they become deaf to recall!
He is now 19months old and can be still selectively death but does come back - not always in my time but his! He was a nightmare jumping up at poeple and racing off after other dogs - however now he is no waye nearly as bad and he will sniff other dogs, play a bit and then come away. He is obsessed with balls so would rather play with them.
Colin is great and has good recall - he'll also follow Dexter around so it makes it easier.
I did see a trainer who suggested using a whistle and clicker and high value treats. She suggested starting off in doors and then in the garden; then progressing on to 2 of you working with the dog.
Good luck - I'm not sure I could manage Dexter on the lead for all of his walk - think he would go a bit stir crazy!!!
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Dexter_Mir
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Re: Off lead n recall

Post by Dexter_Mir » 31 Mar 2009, 18:16

Same here i let all my dogs off lead the first day they were allowed out, the advice is that they will not go far as they want to be near and are a little aprehensive, so wont fun off.

My most recent pup, Mir runs off with the other two dogs, but always stops when they have gone to far and she feels unsafe and back she comes. It best to start recall now. Nigel (OH) walks ahead with them and i wait, call her back with a treat and praise for reward. nigel then calls her back and lots of priase for "come". Sometimes one us will hide behind a tree and call her and she comes a running !!! Its good stimulaiton too.

The trouble with not letting them of lead, is when you finally do, they are bigger, less worried and more inclined to run off and it makes recall a lot harder...

So i am in great favour of letting them off the minute they are allowed out, nervous owner often makes for a nervous dog !!!

Go for it now and let them stretch there legs and practice recall young in quiet and busy areas.

Dee xx

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Rhonk
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Re: Off lead n recall

Post by Rhonk » 31 Mar 2009, 19:17

sorry i can't offer any expert advice - but reading this it's good to hear that others are out with the longline - i haven't seen anyone else out with one, but i'm there every day in the park with it. I think it's making a bit of a difference - it's been just over a month. How long until i don't have to take the bag with the line out everywhere i go with bonzo!!!

tashanlouie
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Re: Off lead n recall

Post by tashanlouie » 31 Mar 2009, 19:47

Rhona you should see me out in the park with the 30ft longline I get some very strange looks :lol:
Tasha

mistydog
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Re: Off lead n recall

Post by mistydog » 31 Mar 2009, 20:47

When Freddie was younger I could let him off along the lane, did the recall, walk on, not putting back on lead. Now he just will not come back, in our garden, in our fields, he just wants to play. After an 1+ hour walk I will take him into the field (2 1/2 acres) where he used to be so good, I run, jump, have scrummy liver treats and he will get through the hedge! We take them in the park at training and he is the worse, thank goodness for the long line. I wanted to be able to ride with him beside me, fat chance of that. We went out today with my OH riding and Freddie just wanted to play with the horse. More than once now if either horse doesn't play he lays down in front of them! I think he will send me MAD!
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Lola
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Re: Off lead n recall

Post by Lola » 01 Apr 2009, 10:07

Early training is key. With Lola I combined recall training with sit and stay training (at 8 weeks old). I done this with her on a lead. I told her to sit ("Lola sit" in a firm voice + a hand signal) i then told her to stay ("Lola Stay" in a firm voice + a hand signal) I then walked to the end of the lead and said "Lola Come" (in an excited voice also with a hand signal). As soon as she reached me I gave her a treat. The next progression is to drop the lead and walk just a little further away. Once you've (you and the dog) have mastered this you can do it off the lead.

As soon as she has learnt a skill I stop giving her treats for doing it. When they have learnt the command they should do it because they are told to and not because they might get a treat. Please note in the example above because she had already learnt the Sit and Stay in the two previous training sessions I did not give her a treat.

It is also very important that you do not overuse the recall command. To start with only use it when you are 100% sure they will come back. They will become deaf to it if you call them 10 times, they dont come back but there's no consequences.

Another technique which can be quite effective if they run off rather than calling in vain, stay silent and go hide. Once the dog realises that you've done a runner they will soon come and look for you.

Another skill which I have found invaluable with Lola is the long sit. Even if she is 100 meters away and I bellow "Lola Sit" she will! The most important application for this is if cars are around (not that she would be 100 meters away if cars were around). In terms of recall this can also help because if she sees a deer or rabbit she will stay in the sit and watch them instead of chasing.

Hope this helps Paul

p.s. this message may be somewhere else because this is now the second time in writing

janettehamman
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Re: Off lead n recall

Post by janettehamman » 01 Apr 2009, 12:53

Lola wrote:Early training is key. With Lola I combined recall training with sit and stay training (at 8 weeks old). I done this with her on a lead. I told her to sit ("Lola sit" in a firm voice + a hand signal) i then told her to stay ("Lola Stay" in a firm voice + a hand signal) I then walked to the end of the lead and said "Lola Come" (in an excited voice also with a hand signal). As soon as she reached me I gave her a treat. The next progression is to drop the lead and walk just a little further away. Once you've (you and the dog) have mastered this you can do it off the lead.

As soon as she has learnt a skill I stop giving her treats for doing it. When they have learnt the command they should do it because they are told to and not because they might get a treat. Please note in the example above because she had already learnt the Sit and Stay in the two previous training sessions I did not give her a treat.

It is also very important that you do not overuse the recall command. To start with only use it when you are 100% sure they will come back. They will become deaf to it if you call them 10 times, they dont come back but there's no consequences.

Another technique which can be quite effective if they run off rather than calling in vain, stay silent and go hide. Once the dog realises that you've done a runner they will soon come and look for you.

Another skill which I have found invaluable with Lola is the long sit. Even if she is 100 meters away and I bellow "Lola Sit" she will! The most important application for this is if cars are around (not that she would be 100 meters away if cars were around). In terms of recall this can also help because if she sees a deer or rabbit she will stay in the sit and watch them instead of chasing.

Hope this helps Paul

p.s. this message may be somewhere else because this is now the second time in writing
Thanks everyone for all the advice. We didn't get Holly till she was 4 months old and being new dog owners as i've said before we are over protective. We will have to be braver with our baby :lol: She does seem to have some recall from garden to house so we will work on going out to a quiet place to start with. I took her out by the river a longer line yesterday and it was very pleasant but she does go near the edge and would definitely be in if there was no lead. She is 25kg + now so there is no way I could pull her out if she was in difficulty so thats a no no.

We will let you know how we get on soon

Thanks very much for your experiences
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peelm
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Re: Off lead n recall

Post by peelm » 01 Apr 2009, 14:10

HI,

I agree with Paul Start young and never stop training.

Fozzie has a pretty good recall, but an even better “wait”. So If I see him eyeing anything (or anyone) up for that doodle hello, I can stop him from launching an all out attack (although he doesn’t jump up anyway) by telling him to wait. I usually then ask if he can say hello, and if everything’s OK I’ll tell him “go see”. This way, he’s learned that, just because I tell him to wait doesn’t mean he can’t go and say hello, or play with another dog.

The only thing about Pauls advice that I don’t agree with is using the dogs name with stay. We have always been told that stay is a singular command and shouldn’t have the name attached.

I also agree wholeheartedly with whistle training our dogs. Foz recalls much better to the whistle than to commands, and any frustration when they choose to ignore us doesn’t come through the whistle. I’m in the middle of training him to “wait” on a long whistle blast. Most of this comes from a mate of mine who trains and uses gun dogs professionally.

Hope some of this is usefull
Michael, Janet, Fozzie and Dylan

For all your pet portraits, visit :- http://www.theloudhouse.co.uk

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Lola
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Re: Off lead n recall

Post by Lola » 01 Apr 2009, 19:31

The main reason that I use a name before stay is so that I can have one dog in the stay while another is sent to retrieve. But most of the time it is good to just say the command so they all do it!

I think if you take your dog for a long walk and spend time training every day they soon learn what is expected of them. Doesnt Cesar say something about boundaries and limitations?

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Bid
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Re: Off lead n recall

Post by Bid » 01 Apr 2009, 19:55

Good luck with Holly. I've always let mine off their leads from the start, but taking on a 4-month old is a little different to an 8 week old pup. She will be a little bit braver since she's a little bit older, so I can see that you'd want to be careful. Do you have a friend with a reliable dog you could go with for the first off-lead excursion? She would probably follow the other dog as it comes back. Other than that I agree with the others - practice at home, have tasty treats, and go somewhere safe & secure. Let us know how it goes!
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MrsAdmin
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Re: Off lead n recall

Post by MrsAdmin » 01 Apr 2009, 21:20

Be Brave :P

Go to the park mid day mid week when it is quiet and make Holly sit and wait, then unclip the lead and say STAY.

She MIGHT, with luck, be so surprised by the change of routine but firmness in your voice (no trepidation or wondering if this will work) and then say Go PLAY and wave her off.

She will bound away but have a really tasty treat in your bag or a squeaky toy and then call her back in a high pitched, squeaky, really excited voice, squeak the toy like mad and flap your arms welcomingly as she runs back, big cuddles and the treat when she comes. Don't worry what you look like. You have joined the mad gang of dog owners who are trying to train their pups. :lol:

Mum is now lovely to come back to. Practice this for ages and she will love it (at 4 months), by 8 months she will be a teenager and not come near at all :roll:

Another brilliant idea we were told by Jack's trainer was to go to a quiet wood with bushes. Let her off the lead and when she's not looking, hide and call her. This is the only time you frighten your puppy. She will panic and try to find you. You then reward her with lots of loving and treat when she does. Practice this a lot, including playing Hide and Seek behind trees and make it a game. She will always think you are so stupid and get yourself lost so easily she had better keep an eye on you at all times :lol:

This has worked for Jack, who is now 18 months, and he will always come back to us (eventually) reinforced with whistle training as soon as you can. I still play Hide and Seek with him, much to other walkers' amusement, but what the heck.. :lol:

Now Becky is a different kettle of fish and has no flipping recall because we rehomed her at 10 months and all she seems to have learnt is that if she came then she would get locked up or beaten we think. She keeps right out of arm's reach at all times. :twisted: Flipping exasperating collar dodger :cry:

We were taught that you have a window of opportunity up to 12/16/20 weeks when a puppy's brain is a sponge soaking up instruction and information that will last him/her for life. Essential to get cracking on off lead training now and be brave. Just be careful you check out for hazards before you start training - no roads, animals, cliffs, water etc.

Good luck and have fun - your doodle will :P
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broadloan
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Re: Off lead n recall

Post by broadloan » 03 Apr 2009, 12:42

hi all. I'm new to dogs and curious about your whistle training. Please excuse me if this is a silly questionm but what kind of whistle are you using? is is a dog whistle or just any old whistle and then do you use different sounds for different commands? Sparky is nearly 4 months now and I have let him off the lead as soon as he was able to go to the park, and he has been great at coming back - possibly because he's quite a nervous dog and doesnt like to be away for long, however, I have seen him now chasing other dogs and I would like him to come back to me when I shout at a distance and wonder if the whistle idea might work. Any advice?

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