Running After Other Dogs... Help needed!

Use this area to seek or offer guidance on specific training or behavioural matters.
nikki79
Posts: 170
Joined: 07 Aug 2010, 20:31
Location: Manchester

Running After Other Dogs... Help needed!

Post by nikki79 » 11 Jun 2011, 19:57

Firstly, sorry this is a long post...

Dexter's recall is pretty good off the lead, he generally comes back to us for a treat and a good fuss. However, he really disobeys us when they are other dogs around. If he sees a dog 100 miles in the distance he just runs to it. We can say stop, leave it, come, wave treats around - he's not interested. He will come back on his own accord eventually, usually when we walk away as if we're leaving him, but its always on his terms.

Last night he ran up to a dog on a lead, there are not many on leads on the field where we let him off but this one was. It was a couple with a cocker who were throwing a tennis ball around but being dragged around by the dog which was on a short lead. We tried in vain to shout him back but he didn't listen. Heis a very gentle dog who just wants to play but the couple panicked and started protecting their cocker from Dexter who was chasing it round their legs. The man, a horrible bloke, started shouting a loud of abuse at us and Dexter. Dexter got really excited by his shouting and waving his arms around and decided he would spring up at the man - tail wagging all the time. They thought this mad dog was attacking them and their pooch and got even more frantic, causing Dexter to do the same. After he had wreaked havoc for a while he came trudging back to us on his own accord, while we got a torrent of abuse from the couple.

It really upset me and I realised we'd let it slide for too long, I want to sort it out because i don't want him to jump up at a child and knock them over, or run to a dog that may bite him. Both would be our fault for not training him correctly. He is just playful and wouldn't hurt a fly but I understand not everyone wants a 25kg dog running at them.

I'm just seeking advice really on how to improve his recall when he has more pressing distractions?

I've got some ideas myself that I've put into action starting today - maybe you could all let me know if they make sense?

Basically, I've gone back to long lead training on this one and I'm recalling him very often using a new command - 'here'. He is getting a high value treat made by 'fish4dogs' only upon hearing this command and coming back. He isn't getting these treats in the house, just outside so its an incentive for him to come.

I understand that his running to other dogs is self rewarding for him, so I'm careful not to punish the actual playing and greeting that he so desperately wants to do.

When we are approaching other dogs and I get the feeling he is ready to charge towards them, I'm stopping dead, restricting his lead length and asking him to come with the 'here' command. Once he comes , he gets a treat and when I say we move on towards the dog - where he wants to be going.

I'm thinking, the reward for coming back to me does not stop at the titbit, but the promise that once he does, he'll get to play. If he doesn't come back when called, we do not move and the walk stops - he doesn't win.

Eventually I want to be able to trust him both on lead and off lead again around other dogs so he will come to me before approaching them, almost like he must ask for permission. I need to trust that when the choice is either come to me, or charge towards the dog, he will choose me. I know it won't work if I deprive him of his wish to play, only if I offer an incentive to come back first. In his little head, the treat is boring compared to playing with another dog, and if all he is coming back for is to be snapped in his lead then why would he?

I doubt this will make him return to me mid charge, but it is the charging/running towards other dogs that I want to stop. If he comes back to me first it gives me chance to get him on the lead if necessary.

Does this method make sense? I've kind of made it up myself based on things I've seen and read.

Would be useful if anyone else has tried to sort out the same problem.

Many thanks.

Nikki & Dexter
Image

Image

Image

john ford
Posts: 639
Joined: 16 Jan 2011, 20:51

Re: Running After Other Dogs... Help needed!

Post by john ford » 11 Jun 2011, 20:25

It must be the name our dexter is just the same ,when he was younger he used to come for a treat but know when i call him he just looks at me and runs off .When he sees another dog its like we are not there he just carrys on playin,john doesnt seem to worry but its like u said u can get some funny people and they dont want a 41k dog runnin at them.Its like i keep tellin john if got no control over him they could run to a bad dog and its to late then ,let me know if u find a way to control them i think its cause he is older with more confidence they dont seem to need us .

nikki79
Posts: 170
Joined: 07 Aug 2010, 20:31
Location: Manchester

Re: Running After Other Dogs... Help needed!

Post by nikki79 » 11 Jun 2011, 20:33

Yes he is 1 now and he is coming out of his shell

I will let you know how we get on with the long lead training :)
Image

Image

Image

User avatar
stout
Posts: 2302
Joined: 24 Aug 2010, 18:16
Location: Reading, Berkshire

Re: Running After Other Dogs... Help needed!

Post by stout » 11 Jun 2011, 22:50

Stout is exactly the same. We have started whistle training him, 4 times out of 5 it works. When he comes back he gets fuss and a dried small fish (only like you when he is out of the house). Chris has also as a last resort, when you get his attention, but he is still far away is to run away from him. That seems to work - eventually. Will be interested to hear how you get on!
Cheers,

Chris, Michelle & Stout

ImageImage

Image

Stout Puppy Pics:
http://photobucket.com/stoutdoodle

Leah
Posts: 945
Joined: 06 Mar 2010, 17:58

Re: Running After Other Dogs... Help needed!

Post by Leah » 11 Jun 2011, 23:00

I do feel for you - there's nothing worse than being shouted at on your walk. I had to work really hard on Monty's recall too as he loves saying hello to all other people and dogs and not everyone loves him as much as us! He's nearly 1.5 yrs now and his recall is brilliant but it has been a lot of work...

I found taking amazing treats helped a lot, and varying them so he never knew what he'd get ( sometimes I have a little bag with pieces of chicken, cubes of cheese, ham, cocktail sausage cut up small etc) He's really greedy which helped!

Also making yourself so exciting that he would rather be with you than another dog. Monty loves a squeaky ball, one squeak and he's at my side in a flash. If you're having a really fun game of fetch with a ball-flinger for example he'll be less keen to go looking for fun elsewhere. Monty won't go near anyone when he has a ball - think he's scared they'll pinch it!

Another thing which works well is walking with a friend and their dog, that way he has a doggy friend to run around with on the walk. I meet up with a group of other dog walkers most mornings and all the dogs have a great time. Monty doesn't really bother with other dogs on those days as he already has plenty to chase about with.

Hope you get it sorted

Leah

User avatar
Bid
Posts: 18722
Joined: 03 Nov 2006, 20:30
Location: South Dorset
Contact:

Re: Running After Other Dogs... Help needed!

Post by Bid » 12 Jun 2011, 00:21

I had to do a similar thing with Daisy - I switched to whistle training - effectively the same as you are doing by using a different command, and used high value treats and a VERY enthusiastic YES!!! when she came back. All other things got a relatively boring treat. The thing that made the difference with Daze was a very excited whistle
as well as the treats. These days she doesn't always get a treat, but she does get the whistle and the Yes!!!, and sometimes the treat.
www.dogtrekker.co.uk
Image
Beauty without vanity, strength without insolence, courage without ferocity, and all the virtues of man without his vices - Byron

campfaz18
Posts: 374
Joined: 22 Oct 2010, 22:39
Location: Nottingham

Re: Running After Other Dogs... Help needed!

Post by campfaz18 » 12 Jun 2011, 10:14

Hi,

Our 'trainers' recommended us carry Jacob's kibble around the park ... so we feed him most of his food as he returns to the whistle. This seems to work most of the time!!!
Nat, Lynne and the boy Jacob


Image

Image

Noglet
Posts: 321
Joined: 12 Jul 2010, 15:21
Location: Welsh Borders

Re: Running After Other Dogs... Help needed!

Post by Noglet » 12 Jun 2011, 10:31

Stan used to be a nightmare with his recall - particularly if he found an interesting scent, or even more fun a dead bird, another dog to play with or a person that he'd simply got to go and say hello to!

For us, the magic moment was when we worked out that he loved his boucy foam ball far more than any treat! :lol: Now, we make sure we have a couple of balls in our pockets then, if he goes to hare off we either call him and bounce the ball near us to get him back on this lead, or we throw it for him to retrieve. It's not 100% foolproof, but it works 99% of the time!
Image

Image

Image

Image

gayle37
Posts: 27
Joined: 24 Feb 2011, 14:48
Location: Bedfordshire

Re: Running After Other Dogs... Help needed!

Post by gayle37 » 12 Jun 2011, 12:52

same here, my dog ran off when she saw 2 poodles on leads and accdiently made one yelp,[she gets bouncy] the grumpy bloke who was walking them shouted "PUT IT ON A LEAD" i called her and she came back but i was not happy as i dont like people telling me what to do with my dog. he did say other stuff but didnt hear as he was walking off. I was mad
:(
But i dont want this to happen again the problem is not recall but she gets over excited when meeting other dogs :?
ImageImage[/img]

helenahigson
Posts: 610
Joined: 04 Feb 2010, 19:30
Location: Felton Bristol

Re: Running After Other Dogs... Help needed!

Post by helenahigson » 12 Jun 2011, 20:45

:lol: could be worse :!: Bailey runs off and tries to hump anything that moves dispite age, sex etc :oops: Coco does come back however so roll on whistle next :?
ImageImageImageImage

Nimitor
Posts: 281
Joined: 22 Mar 2011, 17:22
Location: Cornwall

Re: Running After Other Dogs... Help needed!

Post by Nimitor » 12 Jun 2011, 21:54

Wes is the same, really good recall as long as there are no dogs around.I keep him on a long lead,until he is reliable I just don't want to risk him knocking a child over or frightening someone,I am doing high value treats with him but he is not really food orientated.I shall follow your progress, good luck!
Image

nikki79
Posts: 170
Joined: 07 Aug 2010, 20:31
Location: Manchester

Re: Running After Other Dogs... Help needed!

Post by nikki79 » 13 Jun 2011, 21:07

Well its been about three days of intensive long lead recall refreshing and a little off lead where it was quiet. Dexter is already coming back every time when there are no distractions. When other dogs are approaching I would say 3/5 times he comes back without having to be coaxed back by pulling the long lead. We always follow it up with a lot of fuss, a treat and by allowing him to continue towards the dog and have a sniff etc.

Tonight we let him off for a sprint on a very quiet path in the woods. He came back nicely when asked. Got a bot carried away with ourselves and didn't spot the blind corner up ahead. A poodle (on lead) appeared like a ninja. I saw Dexter lurch forward, tail wagging so I shouted "Dexter... here!" a bit to panicky. He looked at me then chose to sprint towards the dog. Once he had had a sniff he came back quite easily for a change but I was so annoyed with myself. I set him up to fail really which is upsetting, should've kept him on the lead but he was doing so well.

He is not a bad dog, not at all. He is so clever, and such a fast learner, so I know he can do this - it must be so exciting though to see another pooch.

Sure we'll get there.

Thanks for all your tips an anedotes! Don't think you're ever "the only one" when you have a doodle! :lol:
Image

Image

Image

User avatar
Bid
Posts: 18722
Joined: 03 Nov 2006, 20:30
Location: South Dorset
Contact:

Re: Running After Other Dogs... Help needed!

Post by Bid » 13 Jun 2011, 21:45

Nimitor wrote:Wes is the same, really good recall as long as there are no dogs around.I keep him on a long lead,until he is reliable I just don't want to risk him knocking a child over or frightening someone,I am doing high value treats with him but he is not really food orientated.I shall follow your progress, good luck!
Poppy doesn't like food either, so I use a ball on a rope as her reward. If there is no-one about and I recall her from a scent or something, then I throw the ball as a reward. If I recall her from a dog, she gets a game of tug with it. Might be worth a try.
www.dogtrekker.co.uk
Image
Beauty without vanity, strength without insolence, courage without ferocity, and all the virtues of man without his vices - Byron

User avatar
groover
Posts: 692
Joined: 06 Mar 2007, 01:54
Location: glasgow

Re: Running After Other Dogs... Help needed!

Post by groover » 13 Jun 2011, 23:09

It's so scary when they run over to dogs on leads. You never know how it's going to turn out.
When herbie had an attack of deafness, I used a squeaky toy. I never gave him any in the house, he only got to play with them on walks and only if he ignored the dog he was ready to run over to and returned to me when I called and squeaked the toy. Worked a treat.

Xxx
Image

in a perfect world every dog would have a home and every home would have a dog

User avatar
Liz!
Posts: 2868
Joined: 13 Jun 2010, 00:13

Re: Running After Other Dogs... Help needed!

Post by Liz! » 14 Jun 2011, 12:10

Sounds like you are doing really well to me!

We trained Lola to a whistle for her food - so she has to sit and wait before being fed until i 'toot' ona whistle. I've found if all else fails when out, or if I'm really worried about where she's running to, I 'toot' and she bounds back sort of reflexively as the instinct is so strong, the memory of the hunger and the smell of food.
Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read ~ Groucho Marx

Image

Post Reply