Defiant Doodle!

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susiegill
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Defiant Doodle!

Post by susiegill » 17 Oct 2007, 09:37

Hi there

Rosie has always been an easy dog, easy to train as a puppy very laid back, no bother at all! However, just recently there is another side emerging!

On a couple of occasions recently when I have taken her out alone, I have had problems calling her back to the lead. There's nothing I love more when on walks than to let her off lead to run, sniff, roll whatever she feels inclined to do. Our walks have always been a balance between time on and off lead depending on where we are walking. I usually take her ball and launcher so she can have some time chasing her ball. Yesterday, we were on the field and I let her off to chase her ball as usual, we had the field to ourselves, or so I thought! A lady emerged from the wood surrounding the field with a large dog on lead, as soon as Rosie clocked him she was off!! Despite my calling her and shouting no, which usually stops her, she ignored me and went straight to him. The lady with the dog was screaming frantically to keep her away saying her dog was viscious and her would bite her! Still Rosie had run the length of the field and was now in front of him in a playing pose prancing around, just a safe distance away so he couldn't get her. The dog was going mad, I had to leg it down the field to get her, when I got there she ran off in the other direction, and wouldn't come back to me at all so I could put her on the lead!

Eventually I got her back put her on the lead and we continued our walk, when we approached our other field there was definately nobody around so I let her off again to chase her ball. When I tried to get her back on the lead again, she just kept circling me and not letting me get near her to put the lead on. I was getting very frustrated and a little panicky that I wasn't going to get her back. Eventually she just sat down and let me approach her and put her lead back on. She has been defiant in the house as well, commands are having to be repeated a few times before she will respond! It's almost like having a naughtly child in the house - of course OH can still get her to do anything he says!

She's 15 months old now, and I don't want to resort to having to walk her on the lead - also she is due another season in 3-4 weeks time and some people have said that they notice a change in behaviour around seasons.

Anyone else had similar problems - any advice will be greatly receieved.

:oops: :oops: Sorry the post is a bit long :oops:
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Bid
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Re: Defiant Doodle!

Post by Bid » 17 Oct 2007, 11:29

Ahhh - you've had it easy so far then :lol: I too have a problem recalling Daisy once she has spotted something more interesting, but for us it is nothing new, and at 15 months after endless training and practice I THINK we are beginning to get somewhere.

Daisy had a manic phase just after being spayed but it seems to have worn off now - a lot of people suggested it couod be a change in hormones so perhaps you are right with Rosie due to come into season.

All I can suggest is to go back to basics with the training to remind Rosie of what she should do, and take comfort in that you are not the only one :?
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Berni
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Re: Defiant Doodle!

Post by Berni » 17 Oct 2007, 11:46

Hi

It sounds like it could be something to do with the hormones.

Cassie is normally really good - it is always when I tell people she is soooo good - then she will have a really naughty day - and yes the same - spot something/someone more interesting half a mile away and totally ignore me.

Dont worry it must be just a phase and will soon pass - these doodles do it on purpose to keep us on our toes I think :twisted: :twisted:
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Emma
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Re: Defiant Doodle!

Post by Emma » 17 Oct 2007, 15:06

Hi Sue,
Amos has done this too, and I find the "naughty bottle" the quickest easiest way to get him back into line. Its a plastic pop bottle with and inch of dried peas ( or anything loud and rattly). As soon as she comes near you, prancing around, saying you cant catch me - you throw it at her ( not to hit of course, but to land very close) Shout no, and come here. It works a treat for us. :D
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redheadreddog
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Re: Defiant Doodle!

Post by redheadreddog » 17 Oct 2007, 15:40

Hi to all the recall problems seems to be across the field with the doddles we have a dog and he is starting to do the same he like rosie was as good as gold to train and he is so layed back in the house, but in the larst two three weeks he has started doing the same left to run free the first time you bring him back he comes to within 3feet and then its a waiting game, but we have found that if when you call him you drop down and get out off sight he comes because he thinks you have left so far it works try it you never know it may work for you to good luck

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dozydeb
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Re: Defiant Doodle!

Post by dozydeb » 17 Oct 2007, 15:51

Lara seems to have the same powers of recall as Rosie - nil! As soon as she sees another dog/human/bird etc, she's off and refuses to come back. The only thing that is seeming to work for me at the mo is if I turn my back and start to walk away from her and then she thinks I am leaving.

The other day, we were in a field and a tiny little terrier came up to her, and off course Lara wanted to play, and this terrier went beserk, trying to bite her and everything. The owners just looked at Lara as though she was the beast from hell and walked away. Poor Lara didnt know what to do as she's never had another dog be aggressive towards her. I am having a tough time getting her to come back when called, but its a case of persevering I suppose :)

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Ali Cat
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Re: Defiant Doodle!

Post by Ali Cat » 17 Oct 2007, 16:40

Well as far as I can see you all have it easy. Eric has NEVER come back when called despite numerous hours of training. He comes back when he wants to and not before. When we are on our own - fine. But if there is another dog, horse (he goty kicked last week - still hasnt taught him not to dance around their legs tho), bird, cat, kid with a ball, kid without a ball etc etc then I haven't got a cats chance in hell of getting him to come back unless he wants to.

The only thing that works is walking away - but only if there are no other distractions. If I walk away when he's playing with another dog or a kid - then I could be gone hours and he wouldn't care!!

I could cry with frustration sometimes trying to get him on the lead!! :roll:

Love him tho!!
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hannahandwoody
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Re: Defiant Doodle!

Post by hannahandwoody » 17 Oct 2007, 17:03

It sounds so familiar :lol:

We've been through all this with Woody who is almost 9 months old now.

I think probably the first woman screaming and shouting didn't help, Rosie probably wondered what was going on and wanted to take a closer look. I find that when Woody gets hyped up by things like that it makes him get deaf ears. Also, I've found from a horrible experience that when something like that has happened, even though Rosie probably seemed calm, she was probably still really quite excited and that's why she didn't come back when you let her off in the next field!!!

Here's what happened to me- we met a couple of dogs (a lovely Doodle and a Lab) and they were having a mad game, then man on a bike came out of nowhere and the dogs rushed up to him. We got hold of our dogs and went our separate ways, a few seconds after I let Woody off the lead again and he ran straight after the man on the bike and out of sight, it was awful.

He was only 6 months old and had never been out of my sight before, I panicked and ran after him as I didn't know how long he would chase the poor man for!! About a minute later, I was on the verge of being hysterical :cry: , I shouted him again and he came running behind me, I don't have a clue where he'd been the little devil but I learnt two things, if your dog runs out of sight, stay where you are and call them from there and also, don't let them off the lead when they've just been all hyped up! Nightmare. I'll never forget that!

Anyway, here's a few methods we've used-

I would start off calling her back in the house/garden frequently when you know she will come back to you and making a huge fuss of her and giving her treats when she does this first time.

When Rosie does come back when called first time, especially if she has left something interesting to come back to you, I would give her a jackpot of treats ie; a handful or something different like a chunky piece of chicken.

You could also put a longline on her when in the field. This way you will be able to get hold of the end of it when she comes within a few feet of you but won't come right up close, you can then coax her back to you calmly without pulling her in (no treats for this though unless she comes back perfectly without you needing to take hold of the line).

Instead of calling Rosie back in the usual way when you suspect she will ignore you, I would call her name in a very excited high pitched voice over and over and make silly noises. Yes, you will look stupid but it is a real attention grabber :shock:

Can't think of anything else just now but hope it helps!

susiegill
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Re: Defiant Doodle!

Post by susiegill » 17 Oct 2007, 17:21

Thanks everyone.

It was a bit of a difficult situation because the woman with the viscious dog (her words not mine) was getting hysterical shouting to me to come and get her saying her dog would bite. Rosie was blissfully unaware and I was having visions of her ending up at the vets! I was a bit miffed because normally I stand my ground and make her come to me. Been out today with her armed with treats and did some recall training and she was fine. Think we just need to cover some old ground and step up with the training, I suppose you have to always be vigilent with their training.

I just felt such a plonker, and was on the verge of tears due to frustration!

They certainly keep you on your toes these Doodles!
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Bid
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Re: Defiant Doodle!

Post by Bid » 17 Oct 2007, 17:41

Ali Cat wrote:Well as far as I can see you all have it easy. Eric has NEVER come back when called despite numerous hours of training. He comes back when he wants to and not before. When we are on our own - fine. But if there is another dog, horse (he goty kicked last week - still hasnt taught him not to dance around their legs tho), bird, cat, kid with a ball, kid without a ball etc etc then I haven't got a cats chance in hell of getting him to come back unless he wants to.
Thanks for sharing that Ali, it makes me feel so much better to know there are others with the same probs - everyone around here has model dogs :lol:
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Murphy's mum
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Re: Defiant Doodle!

Post by Murphy's mum » 17 Oct 2007, 19:26

When Murphy was smaller (he's 6 months now) we let him out in the garden then blew a whistle and shouted 'sausages' at the top of our voices! :mrgreen: When he came we lavished him with sausages/pigs ears/love/whatever it took - we were nauseating! We never put him on the lead and repeated this several times. We don't use the whistle for anything else just the 'come back now' command. Works every time, just remember to have something tasty! :mrgreen:
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Hilli
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Re: Defiant Doodle!

Post by Hilli » 17 Oct 2007, 19:30

What a nightmare!! We are just starting letting Yogi of lead if theres no one about and so far he's been ok at coming back. The trainer at his puppy class says we should choose a word just for recall as when we shout their name over and over again it goes straight over their heads and we end up sounding like a squeeky toy :roll: . She shouts "RIGHT" when she wants her dogs back nothing else. Thinking of giving it a try.

Good luck

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kATE
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Re: Defiant Doodle!

Post by kATE » 17 Oct 2007, 20:30

Hi Susie ,

Maizee goes through same behavior before her season , 3-4 weeks before like you said !! Definatley 'defiant ' behavior .... Maizee is usually an Angel , never any problems just like Rosie . Maizee is due on her 3rd season end of Nov , so iam expecting the same soon !

susiegill
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Re: Defiant Doodle!

Post by susiegill » 18 Oct 2007, 19:20

Took Rosie out again today on my own, and she was fine have just stepped up the training a bit more :)

Had to laugh she did the same with OH last night, but it was dark and he couldn't even see her, I am convinced it's something to do with her seasons as normally she is so good :lol:
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Ruby Tuesday
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Re: Defiant Doodle!

Post by Ruby Tuesday » 18 Oct 2007, 19:32

I would agree with giving treats fro every recall. Ruby gets a good (but very small treat) every single time she comes when called. She almost always comes immediately, I know she is very young, only 6 months, and may change as she gets older but whats funny is that all the dogs on our walk also come when I call her as they all know I've got treats!!
She's also got a Pavlov reaction to the word Come, which is my recall word. As soon as I say the word she licks her lips, I noticed this when I say the word accidentally so just feed her a treat anyway.
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